Willingham's Scorched Earth
posted by Scott Engler
(*Re-run from cfb360)
Author's note: Often we hear people say "drop it, Willingham's not our coach anymore so it doesn't matter." I heartily disagree. Willingham promoted the idea the Notre Dame was racist and unfair in his dismissal of him and that view has sadly been adopted by the majority of mainstream media and fans. It's therefore very important that the public understand Willingham's record with proper perspective and facts to help them truly assess what was happening. If you're sensitive to the issue, don't read any further. We certainly won't be countenancing any whining about running this article nor printing or reading the comments, we've heard them before and fully understand that point of view. We disagree. If you don't share our point of view, we get that, but do yourself a favor and don't read any further.
I just snicker when I hear commentators talk about Tyrone Willingham needing more time at Washington. More time for what? To kill Husky football for the next five years? If Willingham's allowed to continue he's going to deliver a death knell recruiting class to the Huskies. Babbling idiots like John Saunders and Mark May keep talking about Tyrone needing more time for his recruiting to take hold. They forget that it's already taken hold. It is what it is and what it's always been.
Washington had a good recruiting class last year. Not elite. Not great. Just a good class. It finished anywhere between 14th and 24th in the country depending upon which service you use. That class followed two straight recruiting classes by Willingham that didn't crack the top 25. And the only reason last year's class was good was because there were so many in state recruits that were high caliber. That won't be the case this year or in most years. Consider this fact: over the last three years Willingham has recruited exactly four four-star or higher players from outside the state and only three are with the team. One great player a year from outside the state? That wouldn't cut it at Texas, Florida or USC which are loaded with in state talent. Washington is not. To succeed you have to get at least some of best kids from around the country.
But that folks is as good as it gets under Willingham. Woof, woof.
Currently the Huskies have the 86th ranked class after losing their best player (who decomitted last week.)
Willingham is about to do to the Huskies what he did to ND and Stanford before him.
For those who didn't follow Notre Dame closely back at the end of Willingham's tenure, the most frightening element wasn't the prospect of another mediocre to bad season, it was the recruiting abyss we were staring into.
In Willingham's second season at Notre Dame he recruited one of the worst overall Notre Dame classes in decades. In this third season, he was doing it again, only this time it looked even worse. Two classes that were all but bereft of linemen.
When USC and Michigan are piling up top ten class after top ten class, that dog won't hunt.
Worse still was the fact that Willingham didn't expect things to get much better on the field, which would have ensured three straight bad recruiting years; a virtual death penalty that Notre Dame wouldn't have recovered from 'till this day.
What made all of this maddening to Notre Dame fans was that Willingham wasn't even trying, he simply expected recruits to come to him. Recruiting analyst Tom Lemming labeled Willingham and his staff outright lazy. Willingham would wait and wait to evaluate and offer kids while other coaches mounted full court presses.
Charlie, while still coaching the Patriots, wasn't able to do much to turn that second class around, but finally put together a top 10 class his second year and has followed that up with two top 5 classes including last year's number one recruiting class.
But the die had already been cast. Last year Notre Dame had exactly two offensive linemen in its junior and senior classes.
That's unheard of... or maybe it isn't... read on.
Willingham left Notre Dame with over 5 million dollars in payouts (he was still the highest paid Notre Dame coach last year btw) and then proceeded to scorch ND's reputation, letting John Saunders float charges of racism while Tyrone played the big man.
So that's Notre Dame. Scorched and burned. Millions out the window and a black hole in recruiting that's taken Notre Dame to its lowest depths in decades. That scorched earth is finally turning to fertile ground and the Irish are coming back from the dead.
None of this surprises Stanford followers who also felt the black hole of Willingham recruiting, twice.
Willingham created his own black hole back in 1996 when he failed to recruit one offensive lineman that year.
None. Zero. Zippo.
Willingham went 5-6 and 3-8 the next two years and almost got fired. But a 8-4 run against a depleted Pac 10 in 1999 (he was 7-1 against the Pac 10 and 1-3 outside of the Pac 10) saved his job before a third losing season in four years in 2000.
Willingham had his best year in 2001 finishing 9-3. But pain was coming as Willingham's recruiting sowed the seeds for failure again leaving Teevens with what the San Francisco Chronicle called "rampant inexperience on the offensive line" in 2003. Said the Chronicle, "... a line that couldn't run block, couldn't protect the passer and couldn't stand up to more experienced defenses at virtually every turn. " Hmmm... sounds like Notre Dame in 2007.
Here's the Stanford 2003 preview from SI: "The Cardinal is hurting on the offense line with only one experienced returnee in three-year starter Kirk Chambers, the left tackle. Kwame Harris' early departure for the NFL complicated an already dire situation, and now Teevens will have to rely on a host of unproven players, including seven redshirt freshmen."
Sound familiar Domers? What happened?
Willingham's recruiting left Teevens with only... drum roll please... TWO upper class offensive linemen out of fourteen on the team.
In other words, he created the exact same problem at both schools.
Predictably, Teevens (not that he wouldn't have failed anyway) bombed in his second year in the same way Notre Dame did... just slightly worse than Weis's 3-9 last year. What we've learned is that both coaches were playing with a very unstacked deck due to negligent recruiting. Stanford followers speculated that Willingham got out just in time.
It's no surprise to anyone that Willingham led the charge to impose restrictions on coaches' travel. It saved him from having to compete on hard work.
The thing we Domers learned is that Willingham only cares about Willingham. He poisoned the well in every conceivable way upon his departure from Notre Dame. He left a media mess, a recruiting nightmare and a financial albatross. It didn't have to be that way either. If he fired Deidrick he could have stayed (something he did anyway when he went to Washington.) He didn't and that turned out to be the best thing that has happened to Notre Dame football in years. It's taken four years to cleanse the stench of losing and divisiveness. Much like Washington now, Notre Dame's players were just plain quitting in games, which happens when you have a coach that refuses to accept responsibility. That attitude takes a long-long time to change.
But now the Huskies are facing the same Willingham imposed virtual death penalty. A null recruiting class following one decent and two mediocre classes will hamstring the Huskies for years. And if you thought Willingham didn't work hard on the recruiting trail before, you ain't seen nothing yet. A lame duck Willingham won't be able to take the insult of rejection. Remember Tyrone only cares about Tyrone and recruiting takes a lot of groundwork.
Recruiting isn't microwave popcorn ya know.
Most Domers think that Willingham's a self-important con artist who talks in strange platitudes that sound smart when you first hear them, but upon reflection make little sense and mask his lack of understanding of the issues. I used to think his stern looks had meaning, now I just view them as funny faces he makes when he's clueless.
At Stanford he opined what he would do with Notre Dame's players. At Notre Dame he wondered what he would do without the restrictions. Lack of performance was always someone else's fault. I have no idea where he goes from here, but I believe that if he had an offer to go to another school with a good golf course nearby, he'd be on a plane already.
But after scorching the earth from South Bend to Seattle, it looks like this time the jig's up. When he leaves, don't expect it to be pretty. At Notre Dame he took people down with him and some reports claim he's already done that with Todd Turner at the Dub.
As AFCA president, Willingham may yet have another surprise in the works.
Author's note: Often we hear people say "drop it, Willingham's not our coach anymore so it doesn't matter." I heartily disagree. Willingham promoted the idea the Notre Dame was racist and unfair in his dismissal of him and that view has sadly been adopted by the majority of mainstream media and fans. It's therefore very important that the public understand Willingham's record with proper perspective and facts to help them truly assess what was happening. If you're sensitive to the issue, don't read any further. We certainly won't be countenancing any whining about running this article nor printing or reading the comments, we've heard them before and fully understand that point of view. We disagree. If you don't share our point of view, we get that, but do yourself a favor and don't read any further.
I just snicker when I hear commentators talk about Tyrone Willingham needing more time at Washington. More time for what? To kill Husky football for the next five years? If Willingham's allowed to continue he's going to deliver a death knell recruiting class to the Huskies. Babbling idiots like John Saunders and Mark May keep talking about Tyrone needing more time for his recruiting to take hold. They forget that it's already taken hold. It is what it is and what it's always been.
Washington had a good recruiting class last year. Not elite. Not great. Just a good class. It finished anywhere between 14th and 24th in the country depending upon which service you use. That class followed two straight recruiting classes by Willingham that didn't crack the top 25. And the only reason last year's class was good was because there were so many in state recruits that were high caliber. That won't be the case this year or in most years. Consider this fact: over the last three years Willingham has recruited exactly four four-star or higher players from outside the state and only three are with the team. One great player a year from outside the state? That wouldn't cut it at Texas, Florida or USC which are loaded with in state talent. Washington is not. To succeed you have to get at least some of best kids from around the country.
But that folks is as good as it gets under Willingham. Woof, woof.
Currently the Huskies have the 86th ranked class after losing their best player (who decomitted last week.)
Willingham is about to do to the Huskies what he did to ND and Stanford before him.
For those who didn't follow Notre Dame closely back at the end of Willingham's tenure, the most frightening element wasn't the prospect of another mediocre to bad season, it was the recruiting abyss we were staring into.
In Willingham's second season at Notre Dame he recruited one of the worst overall Notre Dame classes in decades. In this third season, he was doing it again, only this time it looked even worse. Two classes that were all but bereft of linemen.
When USC and Michigan are piling up top ten class after top ten class, that dog won't hunt.
Worse still was the fact that Willingham didn't expect things to get much better on the field, which would have ensured three straight bad recruiting years; a virtual death penalty that Notre Dame wouldn't have recovered from 'till this day.
What made all of this maddening to Notre Dame fans was that Willingham wasn't even trying, he simply expected recruits to come to him. Recruiting analyst Tom Lemming labeled Willingham and his staff outright lazy. Willingham would wait and wait to evaluate and offer kids while other coaches mounted full court presses.
Charlie, while still coaching the Patriots, wasn't able to do much to turn that second class around, but finally put together a top 10 class his second year and has followed that up with two top 5 classes including last year's number one recruiting class.
But the die had already been cast. Last year Notre Dame had exactly two offensive linemen in its junior and senior classes.
That's unheard of... or maybe it isn't... read on.
Willingham left Notre Dame with over 5 million dollars in payouts (he was still the highest paid Notre Dame coach last year btw) and then proceeded to scorch ND's reputation, letting John Saunders float charges of racism while Tyrone played the big man.
So that's Notre Dame. Scorched and burned. Millions out the window and a black hole in recruiting that's taken Notre Dame to its lowest depths in decades. That scorched earth is finally turning to fertile ground and the Irish are coming back from the dead.
None of this surprises Stanford followers who also felt the black hole of Willingham recruiting, twice.
Willingham created his own black hole back in 1996 when he failed to recruit one offensive lineman that year.
None. Zero. Zippo.
Willingham went 5-6 and 3-8 the next two years and almost got fired. But a 8-4 run against a depleted Pac 10 in 1999 (he was 7-1 against the Pac 10 and 1-3 outside of the Pac 10) saved his job before a third losing season in four years in 2000.
Willingham had his best year in 2001 finishing 9-3. But pain was coming as Willingham's recruiting sowed the seeds for failure again leaving Teevens with what the San Francisco Chronicle called "rampant inexperience on the offensive line" in 2003. Said the Chronicle, "... a line that couldn't run block, couldn't protect the passer and couldn't stand up to more experienced defenses at virtually every turn. " Hmmm... sounds like Notre Dame in 2007.
Here's the Stanford 2003 preview from SI: "The Cardinal is hurting on the offense line with only one experienced returnee in three-year starter Kirk Chambers, the left tackle. Kwame Harris' early departure for the NFL complicated an already dire situation, and now Teevens will have to rely on a host of unproven players, including seven redshirt freshmen."
Sound familiar Domers? What happened?
Willingham's recruiting left Teevens with only... drum roll please... TWO upper class offensive linemen out of fourteen on the team.
In other words, he created the exact same problem at both schools.
Predictably, Teevens (not that he wouldn't have failed anyway) bombed in his second year in the same way Notre Dame did... just slightly worse than Weis's 3-9 last year. What we've learned is that both coaches were playing with a very unstacked deck due to negligent recruiting. Stanford followers speculated that Willingham got out just in time.
It's no surprise to anyone that Willingham led the charge to impose restrictions on coaches' travel. It saved him from having to compete on hard work.
The thing we Domers learned is that Willingham only cares about Willingham. He poisoned the well in every conceivable way upon his departure from Notre Dame. He left a media mess, a recruiting nightmare and a financial albatross. It didn't have to be that way either. If he fired Deidrick he could have stayed (something he did anyway when he went to Washington.) He didn't and that turned out to be the best thing that has happened to Notre Dame football in years. It's taken four years to cleanse the stench of losing and divisiveness. Much like Washington now, Notre Dame's players were just plain quitting in games, which happens when you have a coach that refuses to accept responsibility. That attitude takes a long-long time to change.
But now the Huskies are facing the same Willingham imposed virtual death penalty. A null recruiting class following one decent and two mediocre classes will hamstring the Huskies for years. And if you thought Willingham didn't work hard on the recruiting trail before, you ain't seen nothing yet. A lame duck Willingham won't be able to take the insult of rejection. Remember Tyrone only cares about Tyrone and recruiting takes a lot of groundwork.
Recruiting isn't microwave popcorn ya know.
Most Domers think that Willingham's a self-important con artist who talks in strange platitudes that sound smart when you first hear them, but upon reflection make little sense and mask his lack of understanding of the issues. I used to think his stern looks had meaning, now I just view them as funny faces he makes when he's clueless.
At Stanford he opined what he would do with Notre Dame's players. At Notre Dame he wondered what he would do without the restrictions. Lack of performance was always someone else's fault. I have no idea where he goes from here, but I believe that if he had an offer to go to another school with a good golf course nearby, he'd be on a plane already.
But after scorching the earth from South Bend to Seattle, it looks like this time the jig's up. When he leaves, don't expect it to be pretty. At Notre Dame he took people down with him and some reports claim he's already done that with Todd Turner at the Dub.
As AFCA president, Willingham may yet have another surprise in the works.
36 Comments:
Outstanding my good man !!!!
Gotta say -- given what we went through, I feel sorry for the UW fans and the next coach. It seems like Ty will be leaving the cupboard even barer than what he left for CW. Hopefully for them, with coverage like this and results what they've been, the fans can at least see the train coming toward them, even if they are helpless to stop it.
FYI -- Scout now has Washington's class at #81 (only ahead of Kansas State and Syracuse in BCS schools), while Rivals has it at #91 (ahead of Syracuse alone). Only five commits...
I'm a UW Husky fan and could not agree more. Ty spews nonsense at every turn. After four years, UW now has, according to Ty, "the mentality it takes to develop and be a good football team." I have no idea what that means, but we have zero wins to show for it.
I am an Irish fan through and through, but if I had to pick a team to cheer for if there was no Notre Dame Football, it would be the Huskies. My heart goes out to the great fans of the Pacific Northwest. Maybe these dogs will yet have their day.
No, it's refreshing to hear your take on it. Watching Notre Dame last year was like watching a school that had gone through probation for a few years, limiting recruits and ability to recruit. The damage he did to the Notre Dame program was so severe that, having recruited so many quality athletes, Charlie Weis is still digging out from under the manure left by Willingham.
Some poor program will probably be dumb enough to hire him, merely to get a high profile coach. I'm just glad that ND fans' feelings about him are being vindicated. I'm sorry that U Dub has to be the one to suffer for it.
I'm a lifelong Husky fan and I NEVER thought it could get this bad. I was never that excited about Willingham but I gave him a chance. About half way through last season I realized that he was a complete fraud and a HORRIBLE coach and a lazy recruiter. Let me just say to all the Notre Dame fans out there. I am sorry that I ever fell for Ty's unfair or racists allegations. You are so lucky that you were able to get rid of him after 3 seasons. I've been going to games for 30 years and I've decided to stop going until he is fired. I can't take anymore. I am a season ticket holder and I can't give my tickets away.
AMEN!!!!! I'm a lifelong Dawg fan and it is painful beyond belief to see what Willingham has done to the program. Granted the administration has their share of culpibility but he was paid to coach and I haven't seen any evidence of that in four years. We can't get him off campus soon enough yet the administration is unwilling to pull the trigger mid-season. Go figure....
It is unfortunate the Irish have to play Washington this coming weekend, because our mission must be to pin another loss on the Huskies. Perhaps that will be another nail in the coffin for Ty's job at Washington.
It will be interesting to see what he does next. How can a coach be elected President of the AFCA with a resume that includes being fired from multiple head coaching positions?
did it ever occur to you guys that his total and outright failure at UW will speak volumes and that we, as notre dame fans, have a golden opportunity to be the bigger people while the rest of the country takes notice. i'm not saying it doesn't matter, but continuing to crap on the guy at this point just comes off as petty and bitter. maybe after the game this week we can all finally move on?
I'm a Notre Dame fan that grew up in Seattle. Growing up, I remember how the Huskies dominated the Pac-10 in the late 80s/early 90s alla USC in the 2000s. After Don James left in the early 90s, UW got worse and worse, similar to ND in the post-Holtz era. Actually, James' UW was even more dominant than Holtz's ND, with their 8-man front that would terrorize opponents' quarterbacks and RBs. They ran the 2 quarterback system, and both QBs, Mark Brunell and the older Huard brother, ended up playing in the NFL. Violations and severe punishment by the Pac-10 ended the schools dominance, I remember the Pac-9 shirts that people used after the conference came down so hard on them. One of James' assistants took over, and led the team to some at best, ok seasons, similar to Bob Davie's tenure. Then Neuheisel took over and the team did rather well, beating Purdue in the 2001 Rose Bowl, and having some classic showdowns against Texas in the Holiday Bowl. Neuheisel got the boot because he bet around $10-25k on a neighborhood NCAA Tourney bracket, which I thought was overdoing it, and they had an ex-assistant, who head-coached at Cal in the 80s, take over as interim coach. He coached exactly like an interim coach, maybe going 3 and 8, and they hired Willingham. Although Seattle is very "liberal," most people put winning football games before politics, but the Athletic director was a woman at the time of Willingham's hiring. Like many secularist liberals, the administration had a warm and fuzzy feeling after hiring an "African-American" as head coach, and after having the security blanket of having a job, Willingham thought it was safe to lash out at ND, making underhanded comments about Notre Dame being racist. Although a lack of winning proved to be Willingham's ultimate downfall, I don't think he ever fully understood or respected the ND legacy. I remember a game against FSU in his second season. ND had crushed the Noles the year before in Tallahassee, and everybody wanted to see if ND could duplicate that performance, even after a sub-par record up to that game. It was All Saints Day, and Willingham put some saint emblems on his shoes. They ended up getting crushed, and the next week Willingham commented that all he needed was Jesus to win. Clearly, such comments proved a lack of respect for ND, and that he did not fit in culturally. In Seattle, Ty had everybody behind him, but proved again that he can't win at a major program. Rather than rebuilding U-Dub he has stripped the program of any pride, with guys quitting on the field 1/2 way through the 2nd quarter. It proves he should never have been more than an NFL assistant.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxUIczVCsnA
That video says it all. losingham should never be allowed on a football field again.
The most important point here - and it's been said before - is that Ty objectively failed to recruit linemen. There is no subjective debate about whether he recruited great, good, acceptable or sub-par talent. He did not recruit several positions at all. No coach can survive a class (much less classes) with no linemen. Abysmal.
The results are easy to see, but connecting them to a conclusion in which race doesn't factor in requires character, integrity if you will. I do not see anyone in the media, man or woman enough, to admit they have been wrong.
However, what upsets me the most is how many people have connected this situation with Charlie's performance (team) last year. Sadly, many of them have been domers, who have been in the mob carrying torches to hang Charlie as if he had anything to do with an empty silo of talent. He inhereted the mess and no one can rebuild the program without a pipeline that is full. Look, I will be the first to say that I have not agreed with every move he made, but two things are certain, we are winning and in order to win a nat.championship there has to be coaching stability. I am thankful that the powers within ND who stood by him have better insights than many of the fans and sports writers.
Let me say this and get it up front, I am an African American male and a huge fan of Notre Dame. I have traveled all the way from Philadelphia to attended at least ten games during the Charlie Weiss era. I agree with 99% of what you say. I have some connections here on the East Coast that have told me that one of the top O-linemen in the country now in his junior year -- and a 3 year starter -- really wanted to go to ND, but Willingham's guys told him he HAD to attend the ND camp to get an offer. Are you kidding me? The kid said "but I cannot afford to fly out there..." and the coach reiterrated the requirement. Obviously, with offers from every other major college in the country, the kid chose to go elsewhere. He will be a first round pick after his senior year (next year). Says a lot about the Ty's staff and thier approach.
That said, he was the first coach not to be given the chance to play out his full contract. Even sad-ass Bob Davie got to play out his...So, maybe the hook was a little quick because of Ty's race. We will never know.
I just know that it's good he's gone and great that Charlie is learning how to have fun with the college game...this team could, very easily, be 6-0.
Go Irish.
A couple years ago, I was in an argument with a know-nothing on another (non-sports) board who claimed that Willingham was one of the best coaches Stanford had ever had. I decided to check the records on the Cardinal's web site just for kicks. Of all Stanford head coaches who were at the school for at least two years, Ty Willie has only the 14th best career winning percentage while at Stanford:
1. Floyd C. Brown .892
2. Clark Shaughnessey .842
3. James Lanagan .804
4. George Presley .782
5. Pop Warner .781
6. Walter Camp .735
7. H.P. Cross .615
8. Andrew Kerr .611
9. John Ralston .601
10. Bill Walsh .585
11. Charles A. Taylor .577
12. C.E. Thornhill .574
13. Jack Christiansen .573
14. Tyrone Willingham .549
In addition, eight coaches who were at Stanford for only one year had better winning percentages than Willingham's career mark.
You know, a lot of people said that CW won with Willingham's recruits ... Okay, why didn't Willingham win with Willingham's recruits? Jeff Samardzija was a 2 star recruit, but under CW was one of the greatest receivers in the country. Tyrone had one good year of recruiting, then had a two year squander. Us Domers are now affected by it. With CW's recruiting classes beoming juniors and seniors next year, look for the Irish to make a lot of noise.
I am also a Seattle native, but grew up bleeding blue & gold. Husky fans are usually not kind to the Fighting Irish, so it will be great to watch the Huskies be crushed again this season, except this time, at the hands of the Irish.
I just read the post...very well written and thorough...
"...self-important con artist who talks in strange platitudes that sound smart when you first hear them, but upon reflection make little sense and mask his lack of understanding of the issues."
Willingham had the entire ND fan base pulling for him. He knew it and took advantage of it. He is the epitome of a career slacker that has earned success at another's expense.
What goes around, comes around my friend.
What if Ty wins? Stalin had "Scorched Earth". The Germans lost at Stalingrad. The Russians didn't have the best recruits. Ty
had some big wins at ND. As a QB at Michigan State ? Weis needs to wake up the ECHOES !
Anonymous at 4:49
You are correct that it looks fishy that he is the first coach in the modern era not to finish his term, especially since Davie got 5 years. Many of us believe that it was precisely the fact that Davie should have been fired after three years but wasn't that necessitated firing Willingham
after three. We knew after three that Davie was going to fail, and adding two years didn't change a thing, and retrospectively, everyone agreed we knew enough at three years to have acted then.
After three years with Willingham, we were at least as certain he needed to be fired, and all trends (recruiting) pointed further downward, and we could not afford to wait again like we foolishly waited with Davie.
JTG
I agree that Willingham was a terrible coach and extremely lazy recruiter who had no clue how to recruit Notre Dame, and I agree that he was the main reason for our problems last year (that, and mediocre recruiting by Weis his first full year), but when did he promote the racist idea, which is the basis for your entire article? I just don't recall that.
Jim, your post at 3:27 PM was on-target with what you said about Domers who wanted to hang Charlie after the '07 season.
They were vicious and very wrong.
Did you hear Mark May on College Football LIve last Thursday?? He was saying Michigan was suffering from a lack of recruiting under the predecessor coach, and would be back.
Huh?? Why didn't he make the same comments about Notre Dame, last year?
I think the problem is Weis started off well, so these idiots just assume the problem was not the prior recruiting, three seasons later.
When to drop it...
IMO we can drop it when TW admits emphatically that his dismissal from ND had ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with race.
I couldn't have said it any better. I know this is a bad Washington team but I think flat out destroying them is what we have to do. We'll finally be able to put those horrible three years behind us and show the scum bags previously mentioned that they should start digesting crow right now. ND is on its way to the top of the polls. All the KNOWLEDGEABLE sports fans know that already!
Go Irish!!!
Let's cut right to the chase: ND fired Tyrone Willingham because Ty is black and ND is racist. See:
http://law.nd.edu/center-for-civil-and-human-rights/history-and-mission
Wait, no, that's not it. That's Fr. Hesburgh and Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King. Holding hands. In the 60s. At the height of segregation. Let's try that again.
http://www.amazon.com/Notre-Dame-Vs-Klan-Fighting/dp/0829417710
See. Wait, damn. Wrong again. That's about how ND fought against the Klan when being in the Klan was still socially acceptable.
Well, I stand corrected. Maybe Ty was just a bad coach?
Does anyone feel that either John Saunders and/or Mark May may exhibit a slight tinge of racism?
Just because ND fired TW after three years - because he was not doing what needed to be done to produce a winner (lack of recruiting, poor choice of assistants, a possible trip to the links during game weeks) does not equate to racism. In business, if an employee is not producing after three years on the job, most will cut the cord regardless of skin color.
An Alumnus
Nicely done. TW had the entire ND Nation behind him and left for what he thought were "greener pastures". The only reason Willingham hasn't fallen farther a UW is because Locker was a dedicated local talent who wanted to stay in Washington and is a great QB, without Locker TW wouldn't have been around for this season.
Further, if anyone should have been given more time it should have been Davie. He recruited much better and left a great base team for Willingham to win his first season. (Remember the West Coast offense genius who had no offensive touchdowns in 3 games won by Davie's defense and special teams).
Until TW admits racism was not a factor in his ND termination and tells guys like May and Saunders to shut up and stick it; he deserves all the criticism and blogging this site can give.
The Mark Mays, John Saunders, and William Rhodens of the world cant possibly believe what they are saying can they? Maybe they feel in their positions they have to stcik up for the African American no matter what. race had nothing to do with it, he was a failure and I agree with the earlier poster that said until Ty or one of May or Saunders and the like admit they were wrong, we have the right to keep piling on. Go Irish
Great article and couldn't agree more. But, as much as I can't stand Willingham, don't blame him for last year. Charlie Weis is the MAIN reason for last season's pathetic display. Just remember Weis still hasn't beaten USC, he's supposed to be an offensive genius, but you saw last year, and now he doesn't even call the plays. He's never recruited defense, and if you disagree, then where's it been? Weis is much better than Ty, and it shows, but I'm not sure I can say just how much better we really are. Give credit where credit is due.
I disagree with the last anonymous. Weis has recruited Defense, and in the last 2 classes they have a lot of highly ranked defensive players. The problem is we havent got a difference maker on the DLine yet. Omar Hunter possibly couldve been that but he defected to go with that lowlife Urban Meyer and Florida. Players from the group of Williams, Johnson, Fleming, Filer and Cwynar could possibly develop into differnce makers in the front 7. Also, yes Fraudingham could be blamed for last year because as was posted our upper classes were bereft of OLineman and that was the main reason the Irish were so bad last year. Our OLine is improved and still pretty young with hopefully room for more improvement. I know I am getting a little off the topic here but with how young the team is and hopefully continued improvement in all areas and the hopeful return of Darrin Walls next year, Im thinking at least top 10 next year and if things break right maybe even better.
I have heard a lot of claptrap about Ty not getting to finish his term. Do you have to finish throwing up before reaching for the Pepto? We had seen Gerry and Bob, and the scenes were too vivid to forget. The only thing Ty had happen to him was the unfortunate circumstance of following a coach they had let stay on too long. The telling thing about Ty was his rebuttal at a press conference in 2004 that the Irish did have a winning record, and that alone should get the media off of his back. I don't think he grasped the magnatude or expectations of the job.
Mark May is a bigot, I don't use the word racist because I'm tired of hearing it. Blacks can say what ever they want towards whites, but if a white guy mentions something about a black,the liberal media is all over them.Don't fall for this white guilt trip that white liberal attempt to use...
Mike, Ill go you one better. Mark May is just a complete clown in every sense of the word. After the North Carolina loss he piled on talking about NDs weak schedule. Before last weeks games it was in the top 30 in strength of schedule in the Jeff Sagarin ratings, and they have their toughest and arguably their 3 toughest games left to come. All the talk about NDs sched by the talking heads on TV but no mention of Penn Sates 82nd ranked schedule according to those same ratings and if Penn St wins the 1 hard game on their schedule this Saturday, we will probably be sucbjected to a Big 10 team in the BCS Title game for the 3rd year in a row and we know how that turned out the last 2 years.
I agree totally, had Willingham just left ND and minded his own business, I wouldn't care about him one bit....
but the fact that he set our team back 5 years, and then had the gall to play the race card is infuriating....
at least he is about to have lots of free time to golf...
TIMNEELY,
I do not follow Stanford, but a casual mention of Ty being one of their greatest coaches ever immediately places him in the same class as Bill Walsh, an innovative genius who changed the face of football. INSANITY!!! Football is insulted by such a remark.
As an outsider (best friend is a ND fan so I follow ND), I think one reason Ty was fired so quickly and Bob Davie was not was because the times had changed dramatically in a short period of time. The need to win is big and ADs think (or know--it is hard to tell at times) that they cannot give as much leash as their predecessors did.
I doubt you will ever see a Frank Beamer or Jim Leavitt situation at a FCS school again. That is a coach being given many years to build a program.
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