The Super Bowl Parade was gang warfare
by El Kabong (2024-02-21 15:11:47)

In reply to: You might, but most dont  posted by vermin05

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The people using guns at that parade were using them illegally and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

If "we can't even have a Super Bowl parade anymore", that's due to gangs, not due to guns.

How do gangs get their guns?
by vermin05  (2024-02-21 15:15:53)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

Do you think it might have a little bit to do with our lax sale requirements, and zero responsibility for selling parties to make sure a gun doesn’t end up where it should? How do you know the guns are are even illegal? They may have been bought lawfully.
A large % of guns recovered in Chicago crimes originated
by wpkirish  (2024-02-21 15:35:07)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

from just a couple of sellers.located outside the City limits. I am sure that is a coincidence. The iron pipeline from Southern States with limited gun restrictions to Northern States with more restrictive gun laws has been written about extensively. The State of Tennessee loosened their gun laws a decade ago to permit storing them in vehicles with no penalty for leaving them unsecured. During that time nearly 30,000 firearms have been stolen from vehicles. In 2022 there were 5,000 guns stolen from cars in the state.

I grew up with lots of friends who hunted and know many who have one for "protection" but this quote from the sponsor of the legislation exemplifies the problem to me

"Listen, freedom comes with some dangers. That's one of the things that made our country great is that we put the power in people's hands," said Rep. Jeremy Faison, an East Tennessee Republican who sponsored the 2013 legislation.

Then prosecute those sellers
by El Kabong  (2024-02-21 15:45:27)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

And prosecute the straw buyers purchasing the guns illegally.
What about gun show loopholes? What about mental health
by wpkirish  (2024-02-21 15:56:53)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

warnings?

The idea we can do nothing while kids die in their schools due to a tortured reading of the second amendment is shocking to me.

As Scalia wrote “Like most rights, the right secured by the Second Amendment is not unlimited,” “the right was not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose.”

Gong back to the original idea,the wording may have been too broad but I would include gun rights groups who push the idea of no restrictions whatsoever and talk about second amendment solutions to elections are every bit the problem of the other groups.

I'm in favor of fixing both of those
by El Kabong  (2024-02-21 17:56:06)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

But the vast majority of red-flag laws in the country are never utilized. I would prefer they would be. I'm all in favor of prosecuting parents of underage shooters, for example.
And I think to the original point of this thread while the
by wpkirish  (2024-02-21 19:54:30)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

language may have been imprecide I believe vermin's original post would distinguish between your positions when they get fleshed out (which are likely in line with 90% of the gun owners) and those who say no restrictions ever.

They were used illegally
by El Kabong  (2024-02-21 15:32:33)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

I'm fine with more responsibility for selling parties.

George Carlin always said the way to really hamper the drug trade in America wasn't to go after the dealers but rather the bankers who launder the drug money. Maybe a little hyperbolic, but I saw the wisdom of it.

The way to put a dent in the gun trade is to go after the straw buyers with zero tolerance. But that's too much of a nuance/inconvenience for prosecutors, especially where I live.
I assume you are referencing Cook County
by wpkirish  (2024-02-21 16:07:05)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

What are they to do about sellers in Indiana or Tennessee?

Do you support closing the gun show loophole / private sale exemption? Do you support a database of purchases where law enforcement could look for patterns that might indicate straw purchasers?


These are the type of regulations the most extreme guns rights advocates oppose.
Chekov's Guns
by ravenium  (2024-02-21 15:41:24)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Cannot reply

I kid, but the sheer number of guns in society basically is causing their misuse. It's inevitable. When you have access to destructive, easy tooling with low barriers to entry, it becomes a solution to your problems.

Gang violence and mass shooters are distractions (albeit deadly ones) for our real problem - the proliferation of firearms with no training or sense of responsibility. Angry? Pull out your gun. Fearful of someone bringing a gun to your movie? Bring your gun! More guns means it's more likely someone will misuse one.

Look, I own several firearms myself, having inherited some and purchased some others. I have a CCW permit (which, thanks to our generously lax interpretations of the 2nd, my state is one of the diminishingly few that actually makes you show you can handle a gun properly before carrying).

I'd give them up in a heartbeat if it'd mean fewer deaths. I don't for one second think "I need a gun when the people with guns come for me!". If it's come to that, there are many other things that have failed.

The 2nd was created for militias in defense against the state and kings - honestly I simply disagree with the courts' interpretations for the past 30 years. It's nowhere near the 1st in terms of natural rights that we imbue on humans, but damned if you'd know it from looking at the way we worship and revere it.