I'm surprised they haven't mothballed it already.

It's too bad, really. Very tight group of people and, in the early 90s, hardly any oversight at all.

I have been told that the long range plans have Keenan and Stanford being leveled. I cannot imagine Carrol would be left standing longer than those two.

Do all of the current official long range plans include leaving Carrol Hall in place?

But again, long range planning is long range and future plans are always subject to change.

Keenan walls are stronger than that of the Wall guarding the seven Kingdoms of Westeros. I guess Stanford will stand too and I'm okay with that. Perhaps the wreckingball will bounce off and will make Zahm crumble for the better of the campus.

...which is the latest one published, shows a "Long Term Plan" on the last two pages of text (numbered pages 20 and 21). Carroll still appears (see the aerial view map on the right side of page 20), but that doesn't assure its survival.

The long term plans foresee clusters of buildings in the north and northeast portions of campus, where there are currently a lot of parking lots and open space. Under "Planning Guidelines," numbered page 7, the Campus Plan states,

"Undergraduate residence halls will be clustered to create communities and located to balance the campus around its historic core. The planning for future buildings will strive to achieve multifunctional spaces in order to promote a sense of community and interaction among the faculty, students and staff."

Carroll's isolated location is not planned to become one of the building area clusters shown for the north and northeast areas, which I think may portend its eventual demise, unless it gets repurposed somehow. It's hard to imagine it as classrooms or administrative space, notwithstanding the conversions of Flanner and Grace years ago.

Campus Plan 2017

on the west side of Notre Dame Ave, south of the Morris Inn?

I'd forgotten how much open space there was between the Post Office-University Club-CCE and the Stadium.

...because it's the current bookstore (you can see it also in the 2000 and 2017 maps with the same shape), which was built in 1998. That area was all open field or parking lot.

of holes on Burke Memorial between the Morris Inn and Cedar Grove along Notre Dame Ave.

their friends tailgated. When I was in college, they always said, “meet you at gate 14.” Always knew where to find them.

Statements of fact:

1. Notre Dame never had jurisdiction over Carroll. Their rules did not apply west of Holy Cross Drive. We drank what we wanted and we claimed we fucked chicks. They at least slept over a lot.

2. 93% of all times I have laughed myself into a respiratory event occurred in that building.

3. Of the 20 strangest people I've ever met, least eleven lived in Carroll.

4. Guys who lived there once lit a steel trash can on fire, as part of a "homeless person" party theme.

Notre Dame has no authority and should be given no ability to "demolish" Carroll Hall.

But there's no need to be pussies about it and protest.

Instead, this should be handled as a matter of commonwealth business. We should agree on a day -- maybe Friday of an exam week -- and burn it the fuck down. I am willing to contribute some jet fuel and $1,500 worth of alcohol for this party. I'll see if I can't get the Mrs. to give me an HJ in a van in D6 at the end of the night.

Does this proposal interest anyone?

1 - the Haunted House Carroll guys used to put on (before the pc police took over and all fun was eliminated). My freshman year we had a chain saw scene in the basement that caused one girl to wet her pants. My sophomore year we had the Tunnel of Touchy-Feely on the second floor (which I believe caused a few complaints).

2 - My senior year I had a full bar in my room...I'm talking most every type of liquor possible, complete with pourers, along with mixers...SYRs our senior year were phenomenal. I'm told having a stash like that these days would not only get me kicked off campus, but likely kicked out of school.

3 - Full-on poker games my junior and senior year in the middle of the hallway on the fourth floor...we'd pull out a table and set up shop in the middle of the hallway and play all hours into the night.

4 - Parietals were viewed as a recommendation, not necessarily something to be followed. I cannot remember anyone being busted for a violation of parietals during my 4 years there. We used to joke that Carroll's overnight population was 106 Sunday-Thursday but on Fridays and Saturdays it ballooned up to about 120 on average.

5 - Our own section of SDH regardless of which side was serving (left-left or right-left). It was pretty much respected by other students.

including an Accounting final that I had taken as a "what the hell" elective senior year and prioritized the poker game over any amount of studying.

The touchy-feely tunnel was on the first floor and ultimately what caused the Haunted House to get shut down.

And we did well enough to set several traditions like the go Irish banner, winning regatta boat for 15+ years, Christmas tree thing, etc

We also created the boozic (or busic) fest, held parties on the chapel roof, and were the last class to have hard liquor/ lax parietals policy. I also smoked in the dorm because it was allowed by du lac but god that was gross in hindsight.

the infamous "Hall Notes" scandal.

But only if at the end of the party we spray paint Carroll on the front of every guys dorm and every girls dorm too because Carroll is a girls name.

Gothic architecture?

I was so hoping the Plan would be to send a Special Ops Unit of NDN Meanies and Vermin Alumnae to campus and effect a Carroll Coup. (I was going to say “hostile takeover” except never would a group of men be so ecstatic to become subjects to a foreign power.)

Take over the joint. Make it into Carroll Nation. Form a gubmint with a King, a Benevolent Despot, an unelected Duma, a Rush Chairman, and also some Carroll-ales as the muscle arm of the young state.

I will design all uniforms and regalia. Humbly.

We’ll soak them in the jet fuel, and toss them on the funeral pyre.

Coming up with a theme is one thing, following thru with it is what truly makes it special.

For a section dance we planned to decorate the whole hallway walls with pink insulation, and then pput a brown fur rug around the outside the main party room door. Inside the party room would be a giant ball. At some point during shortly before parietals, someone in an all white costume would burst into the room and throw a bucket of white yo cream on some unexpecting party goers.

The party theme - A Journey Thru the Vas Deferens.

It was nixed largely due to funds (that insulation was way too expensive for such a use) and because we ended up on probation for our "you can't fit in, you can't come in". Skinny girl cardboard cut out party.

Legendary stuff.

Plus they were allowed to stay through the end of their junior year...they weren't immediately kicked out. If memory serves, it happened sometime early in the spring semester (still cold af outside).

Fake blood, disassembled mannequins, lights and tinsel.

But we were Flanner, which was for men, and they knew it.

in the early 90s. Tagline: "The Night We All Got Bombed."

1990 or 1991 had the "Welcome to the (Urban) Jungle" SYR, which saw the dorm giving out doo-rags as tokens and decorating with chain link fencing and concrete blocks.

I guess it was just the relative proximity of our dorms, and a good group of guys in Carroll, but a lot of the guys I'd hang out with outside of my own dorm were Vermin.

Partially for your own good. (The jet fuel)

Even if they stop using it as a dorm, it's sad to see a nice old building like that go. (Of course, some of the ones over there were unstable old buildings, but still.)

Despite some of the seeming disadvantages of living way the hell out at Carroll (and there are some when it’s -15 degrees in February), it was the best dorm we could ask for, and 25 years later there is a group of literally 20+ of us who stay in touch and still get together to see each other. I’d be saddened that other guys wouldn’t have that opportunity.

It must have been very cool. In the late 2000-2010s, though, rule enforcement wasn't scarce. In fact, RAs would walk around, put there ears to the doors to try to see if they could hear something justifying them entering and res lifing.

With the geographic isolation that was a horrible combination.

Well, I’m two years younger. But I’m sadly blanking on a Vermin from KC. Did you play football in 08?

And dealing with FJ fucking sucked. Only good thing was he couldn’t go upstairs, and we could pretty easily go up the side stairs.

Edit: saw your hall president post below. I know who this is. That was bullshit. FJ again.

That would have been a sight to behold.

In his defense, I did a lot that would likely have justified the unilateral removal, just not what I actually got caught for.

Can’t decipher who you are from your profile, but feel free to shoot me an email, lots of us in Chicago.

An RA in 2001 broke the code and got a friend kicked off campus for parietals. Meanwhile his girlfriend had been staying over every night for like 3 years. Around 5 times that year we duct taped a tarp to his door, filled the space with leaves, and then waited.

Graz if you’re reading this it was me and I have no regrets.

the Carroll guys from my era had a tighter bond, dorm-wide and within their class, than most of the other groups. Hell, we had as many guys in my year living in Morrissey as Carroll had total residents. Every dorm experience is unique, but I'd say the experience that what Carroll residents had was different from what you'd get in Sorin, Dillon, Keough, or Siegfried.

Holy Cross Hogs. His group of friends was *extremely* tight. His little sister — and all of us, her friends — immediately became their little sisters.

From knowing them I’d say that living in a dorm set away from campus definitely created closer bonds.

Those guys were nuts. Most of them were certifiable geniuses, very kind, but man they could party.

The dorm life was great. You could enjoy much of the same by moving the dorm closer to campus and making the rooms bigger. Also there aren’t enough showers per resident. I could go on but it need updating.

Huge rooms, basketball court and lawn, lake and track right outside the door, Dome views, gentlemanly reluctance to force girls to make long walks home in the dark, and virtually no rules or standards regarding booze.

In the late 90s, and presumably before then, it was the best place on campus. It was a long cold walk, but the virtues far outweighed the drawbacks.

I would not be surprised to learn it needs a good rehab. But I’d rather hear the whole of Boston were liquidated than see that place be razed.

For the whole first semester he would rather sleep on my floor in Zahm than live in Carroll.

because of an overdose of ether, was it?

year because he rarely went to class. Presumably because my floor was too comfy, and then getting lost once he had to move to Carroll 2nd semester.

My junior and senior years, every morning when I woke up in my 4th floor room, the first thing I saw was the Dome and Sacred Heart across Saint Mary's Lake. Couldn't beat that view!

in order to make room for South/God quad female dorms in D6. Am I misremembering?

I just felt like an argument about Popeye's shouldn't elicit the most irrational response of the day.

So there!

to their dorms. The corner of D6 closest to Carroll was at most 50 yds from the side door everyone used...we considered that our own "private" parking

...Two days ago I drove our daughter up to campus so she could check in and get her key for her apartment at Fischer Grad Residences. I noticed a new building with the shell about 50% completed, east of Dunne and Flaherty, which were new dorms built to the east of Pasquerilla West a few years ago.

The new dorm will open next year, and house 225 undergrad women. No name yet, so there's still time for NDN to scrounge up $40 million for naming rights. The only question: what name?

Jr's and Sr's to remain on campus?

They're now required to live on campus. Hence the need for the new dorms.

I know I sure as hell can't.

Or are they planning to use the spot for another college gothic building for someone’s office space?

That was the case with Corby. It's also why they tore down another remote dorm, Holy Cross.

faster than Notre Dame in Paris.

To pay to move it to south quad brick by brick and rat by rat.

Signed,
Resident (2006-2009)

Didn’t have time to get specifics.