Most of these schools are not undergraduate first.

Look at research productivity, phds produced, disciplinary rankings, Times higher Ed rankings, Shanghai ranking or world universities, etc.

Seems like that's the logical place to compare the relative academic strength of the schools in one conference versus another.

If you don't like the US News poll, then, fine, cite another poll, ideally one that's a lot more fluent in the US landscape than some of the non-US polls are.

I think you posted that the B1G is second only to the Ivy "and it's not really close" [that the B1G is vastly ahead of its P5 brethren].

With a perception that the top 5-6 in the ACC are ranked higher in aggregate than the B1G equivalent, I looked up in greater detail. The ACC shows well. Is it better than the B1G? Maybe, maybe not .... but I think it's at least close. The ACC is certainly a lot closer to the B1G than the B1G is to the Ivy.

Further, I think the higher ranked schools among the ACC and the B1G are generally "undergrad first".

Maybe some of the big midwestern state schools in the B1G are PhD factories and/or research powerhouses. If those are the criteria to use, then bring the University Athletic Association into the comparison. That's the D3 conference that includes U Chicago, Wash U, Emory, NYU and a few other luminaries. I'd bet it blows the B1G's doors off.

I actually almost listed them as the 2nd best academic conference in the United States.

If we focus on undergraduate education only, I'd take the New England Small College Athletic Conference ahead of the Big 10 and ACC too.

But going down the line there as well, there are a fair number of spots, as a tuition-paying parent, where I would pick the ACC school over the NESCAC school.

For example, I would rather send a kid to Duke or ND over Amherst or Williams, as I simply believe the alumni networks are broader and the resourcing is clearly superior. (I have a Domer. It hasn’t crossed my mind that I’d rather have her at Amherst or Williams. And I’m also sending one to Northwestern — roughly equivalent to Duke — which she picked over Amherst among other excellent choices.)

Who’s third in the NESCAC? Bowdoin? UVa versus Bowdoin? Not sure. My sister went to UVa. She definitely would have picked it over Bowdoin. However, I have no doubt there are plenty who would rather be Polar Bears.

Who’s fourth, fifth and sixth? Middlebury, Tufts and Wesleyan in an order that could be debated? I would rather send a kid to Wake — and I actually have a Deac — than any of those three. UNC versus those three? BC versus those three? We could debate.

Who’s seventh in the NESCAC? Colby? Which school has greater prestige: Georgia Tech or Colby? Maybe it depends on course of study. But it’s not obvious that Colby is superior.

Who’s bringing up the rear in the NESCAC? I’m not sure the pecking order among Bates, Conn College, Hamilton and Trinity. Surely one can get a fantastic education at any of the four. And I suppose they do sound fancier in the aggregate than FSU, Miami, Pitt and Syracuse. Going down the pecking order, this seems to be the area where the NESCAC could most strongly claim superiority.

I think that's one of the things that makes ND great and special. Strong liberal arts taught by actual faculty members, not graduate students or adjuncts.

There are few other large research universities that have aligned their resources so strongly in favor of undergraduates instead of graduate/professional study.

I think students get a better education at Amherst and Williams than they would at Duke or Northwestern if one is looking for liberal arts. But yes, Duke and ND both have superior alumni networks.

Bowdoin's alumni network is fantastic and punches way ahead of schools much larger. But you really have to be immune to the cold up there.

NESACs biggest problem is that the northeast is in a state of population decline and because of what they are, don't necessarily have the scale that a national university does.

Probably under-weighted by most applicants.