Per Brown, the move (which drops 11 varsity sports total)...
by FL_Irish (2020-05-29 17:12:56)

In reply to: Brown dumping their XC/track programs.  posted by G.K.Chesterton


...has nothing to do with tightening budgets. It is being done to improve competitiveness given that Brown typically finishes near the bottom of the league barrel in almost every sport in which it competes. They're focusing on fewer sports in which they believe they can be competitive.

Good luck with that. Any Ivy-minded athletic recruit is going to go to Harvard, Yale, Princeton (because they're the big 3), Penn (often because of Wharton), Dartmouth (jocky culture), and Columbia (often because of NYC) before they go to Brown. Cornell and Brown consistently get the league leftovers when it comes to recruiting. But at least Cornell has some history in a few sports (e.g., hockey).


Plus Brown was actually competitive in T&F/XC. So...
by Rocksteady74  (2020-06-02 22:35:36)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

... they cut sports in which they were competitive, and had more diversity than some of their other sports, to prop up sports in which they aren't competitive. Brilliant.

And I generally agree with your analysis. I would choose Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia and, somewhat reluctantly, Dartmouth, all over Brown.


Brown expecting $100-200 million revenue decline
by fortune_smith  (2020-06-05 04:37:06)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

in the coming school year, with the range depending upon how the on-campus model settles out.

They may say scaling back the number of sports doesn’t have anything to do with budget pressures, but surely they’re taking a scalpel to the athletic budget, as not doing so when facing a $100-200 million revenue shortfall would be a dereliction of duty. I can’t believe they’re taking out nine sports net — eliminated eleven, but added two — and leaving the athletic budget unchanged.

As I have posted on NDN previously, the Ivies, bar Columbia, are in the top 2-3% in Divison 1 in number of competing programs. It’s a significant detour from the academic mission, no matter how Ivy admin and development types like to spin it. I expect to see more Ivies reduce the breadth of their athletic programs, though perhaps those with $20+ billion endowments will be able to resist the financial pressures.

Heading into the recently-announced cuts, Brown had triple the number of men’s varsity programs that Vanderbilt has (six). The undergraduate student bodies are similar in size, Vandy’s endowment is 50% larger, and Vandy benefits from the revenue honeypot of its SEC membership while Brown, like the other Ivies, generates only negligible athletics revenue .... but Brown has triple the number of programs. Doesn’t add up.


Despite Brown having triple the sports I can almost...
by FL_Irish  (2020-06-07 12:56:53)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

...guarantee that its athletic department budget is smaller than Vandy’s, likely substantially so.

My wife coached in the Ivy League for over a decade. Those athletic departments are lean to the point of being unrecognizable to someone familiar with a Power 5 department. Functions that at a place like Vandy would have teams of people (sports marketing, compliance, etc.) staffed by one person, often young, underpaid and inexperienced. The poor quality of athletic training because of under/inexperienced staffing has been something of a scandal at a couple schools.

Early in my wife’s career (mid 2000s) I used to be the PA announcer because they didn’t pay anyone to do it.

I don’t disagree that Ivy athletic budgets are going to be under pressure (although note that they are increasingly funded via specific endowments). But relative number of sports isn’t necessarily a great way to think about their budgets.


Budget should be considered in context of revenue
by fortune_smith  (2020-06-07 14:33:41)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

While relative number of sports does not comment on budget sizes, it does provide valuable context for an out-sized commitment to athletics, both on an absolute basis and a net-cost basis.

The only two D1 schools near the Ivies' zip code in number of sports are Stanford and Ohio State.

Athletic programs consume 15-20% of admissions slots at most Ivies. (Versus probably about 1% at Ohio St. And it will be far, far lower than the 15-20% at Vandy, which is similar in size and national academic ranking to Brown.)

Of course Brown's budget is smaller than Vandy's (and other P5 athletic departments). For starters, Vandy is operating with an SEC budget in football and basketball. They also have one of the top baseball programs in the country, so good that baseball has actually become a revenue sport. Additionally, athletic scholarships are part of the athletic budget at Vandy, whereas athletes' financial aid is part of the financial aid budget at the Browns of the world.

The bottom line is that Brown and its Ivy peers generate virtually no athletic revenue, so their departments, even run in many respects on a shoestring budget, operate at enormous losses. In contrast, Vandy's is probably a net generator for the university.




But in cutting men's T&F/XC they are elevating sailing...
by Rocksteady74  (2020-06-06 20:18:25)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

... from club to D1 status. I love sailing, but I don't see how that improves their mission, and I expect sailing will be more expensive to them as a D1 sport. Overall, the T&F program may have cost more than the difference between club sailing and D1 sailing, but they aren't eliminating a lot of the T&F/XC costs, because the buses will still be driving the women's team to the meets.

The blowback Brown is receiving is well justified. And given the current national focus on race, the diversity angle doesn't help Brown either.


I’m not specifically advocating for cutting men’s XC/T&F
by fortune_smith  (2020-06-07 04:42:59)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

And I’m actually surprised they’re cutting men’s XC.

T&F may be a little more complicated because of the need to build a team for so many different events.

The above-mentioned Vanderbilt competes in men’s XC, but not men’s T&F. I believe Northwestern competes in women’s XC, but not men’s or in either men’s or women’s T&F.

My main point is that Ivy athletic programs are bloated and will be downsized due to broader university budget pressures — even if Ivy administrators cite other reasons.

More broadly, the Ivies have been working diligently on diversity and first-generation education for eons, so they should be fairly well-positioned against criticism on that topic.