The negative posters who want Notre Dame of the 70s back again are becoming intolerable.

Secret sauce! Chuck Martin is going to help the run game? Cover 2 is just too complex to learn, especially compared to Mandarin Chinese?

Look, everyone is entitled to their opinion and I'm not even completely sure where mine lies on this yet. That said, if you limit yourself to only talking to see on these issues, be prepared to have sunshine blown up your ass on a constant basis. He's like pangborn76 with the Latin mass stuff.

However, that seems to be a bridge too far right now. Andy and Grace would rather insult anyone who dares question their impeccable moral authority on this (or any other) topic.

By nature, I’m an optimist. So subjecting myself to the constant and unending negativity of some of these posters is not something I’m particularly interested in doing.

You have no idea what I think and I respectfully request that you stop ascribing positions to me that I do not hold.

I’m shocked by the high level support for football in the NIL era.

I figured ND would continue to ride the fence.

The investments have come so large and so fast after 30 years of waffling that you wonder what’s going on behind the scenes

But it’s a non-alum answer which really pisses off (some) of the alumni.

My take? Notre Dame is Notre Dame because of athletics, specifically football. The legion on subway alumni, the NBC contract, that massive stadium, the billion dollar endowment? It can all be traced back to football. Notre Dame isn’t the only Catholic school around. There are plenty of good ones with good academics and a moral grounding. But Notre Dame had football. And for a while, the ghost of what they were was enough.

Fast forward to the 2020s and all of a sudden, Notre Dame has lost some of its uniqueness. It’s still an amazing school filled to the very brim with amazing people. I should know. I know plenty of them and cherish my relationships with them. But there are plenty of good schools out there with good academics and strong alumni networks. And those damned Southern schools are now targeting the exact type of Midwestern kid who used to look at Notre Dame and only Notre Dame.

So some people who have the ability to change things got together and decided to change things.

It’s not going to be for everyone. Some people are going to left behind. Some people think that they can change things and put the genie back in the bottle. I think that’s almost painfully naive. As someone who’s met a bagman and has seen and heard how things get done, I chuckle at the idea that we can turn back the clock to a simpler time.

Notre Dame, the university, can stand for its always stood for. And apparently there are still plenty of people who believe that or we wouldn’t have a billion dollar football facility incoming.

But I’m sure plenty of people will come in and tell me how full of shit I am. So….

That's my opinion, formed over the past 50 or more years.

for speaking your mind and raising a contrarian opinion. The crowd with pitchforks is likely gathering to hunt you down and browbeat you about your sacriligeous comments.

But there is a group of individuals open to discourse. Who don't shout down opinions that diverge from their own. And I applaud you for raising valid, well stated points.

I attended and graduated from ND. My father attended, then taught there. My siblings attended. My son graduates this year. Those who loudly profess to know "THE PATH" that ND should follow have no more credibility than you. They just have louder opinions and followers.

I agree that ND needs to continue to evolve. I agree that what sets ND apart as a Catholic university of note is the football program. I agree that changes are inevitable, and the current ones are measured and hopefully successful.

I wish coach Freeman success, and success to the students who choose to represent ND on the football field.

(for once in my life trying to be polite, that is) and respond here. It's going to be direct and potentially uncomfortable.

My suggestion that you sit this one out was not primarily driven by you not being an alumnus of the University, although I do feel that there are some areas where non-alums should defer to alums. They can and should still weigh in, but they should understand that they have walked a different, not worse, not better, different path, and have a different relationship with the University. That's not a denigration, it's simply a fact.

What drove the suggestion was your reply in the subthread that "The older we get, the harder it is to deal with change" then "Much of the criticism seems to come from the older alumni who want things to be like they were in the 80s when they were students and college athletics were simpler. Now I won’t engage in the back and forth about that because everyone is entitled to their opinions about the state of college athletics and nobody is really going to change their minds on the subject."

My response: you show up, insult me and other alumni/alumnae, make incorrect assumptions about what we think, note that you won't engage in back and forth, and we're supposed to just smile and nod? I'm sorry, that's not going to happen. I politely suggested that you sit out. If you and others cannot see how your comments and strawman are problematic, then you need to think harder.


Next (and tangential to the main points here), while the athletes at Notre Dame by and large are spectacular representatives of the university, far better than I, there still are a nonzero number of them who are not saints. That's really not anything new, so trumpeting ND as better than others is a problem, and causes more grief than it's worth. That's not particularly pertinent here, but it did deserve a mention.


Then, in a separate thread, you create another strawman: "I’m just going to talk to you and those of your mindset. The negative posters who want Notre Dame of the 70s back again are becoming intolerable."

My response: certainly some like that exist. Most have a different opinion which you are unwilling to or incapable of entertaining.


Moving on, you play the victim card: "I think that it’s pretty simple really. But it’s a non-alum answer which really pisses off (some) of the alumni."

My response: that is weak and beneath you. It also alters people's perception of you. More on that later.


More in that post: "My take? Notre Dame is Notre Dame because of athletics, specifically football. The legion on subway alumni, the NBC contract, that massive stadium, the billion dollar endowment? It can all be traced back to football. Notre Dame isn’t the only Catholic school around. There are plenty of good ones with good academics and a moral grounding. But Notre Dame had football. And for a while, the ghost of what they were was enough."

My response: bluntly, no kidding. The vast majority of people who follow Notre Dame would tell you the same thing. It's no great enlightenment and does not need to be stated on a Notre Dame focused board.


"Fast forward to the 2020s and all of a sudden, Notre Dame has lost some of its uniqueness. It’s still an amazing school filled to the very brim with amazing people. I should know. I know plenty of them and cherish my relationships with them. But there are plenty of good schools out there with good academics and strong alumni networks. And those damned Southern schools are now targeting the exact type of Midwestern kid who used to look at Notre Dame and only Notre Dame."

My response: this did not happen all of a sudden. It was due to repeated failures of leadership and very predictable.


"So some people who have the ability to change things got together and decided to change things.

It’s not going to be for everyone. Some people are going to left behind. Some people think that they can change things and put the genie back in the bottle. I think that’s almost painfully naive. As someone who’s met a bagman and has seen and heard how things get done, I chuckle at the idea that we can turn back the clock to a simpler time."

My response: more strawmen. Very few people are looking to put the genie back in the bottle. They are advocating for strong leadership and forging our own path, which likely is a more difficult, but ultimately much more rewarding one.


Coming back to a point noted earlier in this overlong post. Some time ago you were looking for new employment and a member of the board helped you out in some way. I don't recall the specific details, but I believe that it was behind the scenes. I and many others here congratulated you and were happy that things wound up in a good place for you. Believe it or not, we all want each other to have happy, successful lives. I will tell you that how you have comported yourself in these threads the last few days gives me pause. While previously I would have been inclined to see what I could do or forward along contacts, at this point I would be unwilling to do so. I am not willing to link myself to someone who blatantly misrepresents things then plays the victim. I say this not to be rude (although I understand that I can be and often am a challenging personality, which is something that I try to work on every day but fail at more often than not), but to suggest that you reflect on this, as it may impact you at some point down the line. It certainly has with me. I still wish you well and all the happiness that you can have.


Finally, again regarding subway alumni/alumnae. Notre Dame would not be Notre Dame without them. Their input is welcome in all things, but as noted above, they have walked a different path than graduates of the University, and in some matters I believe that a degree of deference is in order. You and others may disagree, that's just my opinion.


I have no idea if you will see this or not, someone put me on ignore due to uncomfortable comments. But, if you do, be well and have a good day.

add something if you don't mind.

Those who are advocating that ND forge a different path; for ND to do things differently with like minded institutions, etc. are simply ignoring all available evidence to the contrary.

Notre Dame is going all in with this new model, whatever that may be. They obviously have an idea of which way the wind is blowing and they've decided to go with the flow and embrace whatever changes might come. The idea of forging a different path (which is an idea I would largely agree with, I think) is a very unrealistic view at this point, IMO.

I'm not sure if we disagree or not and I concede that I am not an alumnus and I do not perhaps have the insight into things that you or others might.

to the 100MM great white whale at this point.

I largely agree with the rest of your post.

I do still hope that some time in what's left of my life ND once again has a strong leader who can return ND to doing what it does best, which I believe is different than its current path.

I'm not advocating for a league with Duke, Rice, et cetera. I am fine with continuing to try to compete in the big leagues. I don't like the path that appears to have been chosen, and I am commenting in that vein. I'm not suggesting that it can be undone. But my hope is that pressure from alumni might someday impact a future decision.

I find the excess everywhere around the university extremely distasteful. Likewise the pervasive mediocrity and lack of accountability.

Status as an alum or not should have no bearing on anyone weighing in. I do think that alums in general have a different understanding of the place. That's not a knock on you or any non-alum, it's just the result of the paths that each of us has taken.

That’s a very simple formula for not growing as people.

I’ll keep my reply as simple as I can.

I never meant to personally offend anyone. If it was taken that way, then all I can do is offer my honest apologies. I’m not attacking anyone. I feel like some people are taking a position that’s unrealistic and some people are very much gatekeeping what they feel Notre Dame should be and what they should do.

I’d love nothing more than to have an open and honest discussion with people who disagree with me. If we can do that, that’s fantastic. If we can’t, that’s fine too. I hold no personal animosity towards you, even if I do disagree with your position on this issue. I almost take no offense to what is said to me or about me on this message board. I’ve much worse said to me by people in real life. I’m here for discussion and fellowship.

I’ll end with a heartfelt Go Irish.

assuming that you had put me on ignore.

I have not been shy about decrying the failure of leadership at the University - the president, BOT, BOF, AD, and so on. For me that is the fundamental problem that needs to be addressed. I believe that a strong leader who sets a vision and executes it can return Notre Dame to what it can and should be. I am concerned that such a leader is rare and Notre Dame may not find one.

I also am not trying to shout anyone down. I don't believe in that. I will reply as I did to you sometimes when I feel that a given comment was problematic. It was obvious to me on the face of things what the issue was, but I accept that my interpretation of it is my own, and others may not interpret it the same way. I'll say that I don't necessarily believe that, but that I accept it as a possibility. Regarding shutting down discussions or things that I don't agree with, If I am full of sh*t about not doing that and you find me doing it, by all means, call me out. I am plenty aware that I am nowhere near perfect.

Please be mindful of assuming that you know what someone is thinking. I have no idea what Andy is thinking. I don't know the man, and I can't tell you how much of what he posts is bluster versus honestly held opinion. I do think that he wants the University to be the best that it can be, and I read his posts with that in mind. Likewise for you and for everyone else here. Why else would we be here?

I don't expect or want things to be how they were in nineteen dickety-two. At the same time, I don't believe it necessary to build a newer Taj Mahal for the team. Surely there is a middle ground. See leadership comments earlier in the post.

Thanks again for the reply, be well, and have a good day.

We might have different reasons, but the love is universal.

I fully agree that leadership has been terrible. I also fear that it might never improve. I’m hopeful that it will.

Disagreement is the beginning of conversation. I firmly believe that. And if I cross a line, feel free to smack me upside the head.