because he used to a high school HC and then an assistant coach in the KC metro area. He specifically told a kid that he'd be a poor fit for ND and listed out all the reasons. That kid ended up at Oklahoma (playing for Bob Stoops, who people on this board would love to coach at ND...me included despite missing some fire in the belly)

He said this on the radio.

Interestingly enough, that same high school has two kids playing for ND right now. Different kids and different schools are fits for each other...and they aren't. A hs coach SHOULD be watching out for the player and not allowing the kid to make a mistake.

that's part of his job, to advise the kid and give him input. Just because the guy doesn't happen to agree with you doesn't make him wrong. I don't know this kid or this coach at all, but I would assume that the coach has the kid's best interests in mind. I see no reason to immediately assume something nefarious.

You're being silly. You have no idea what the kid's background is, where the coach is coming from, what his recruiting process was like, who the kid has for family, etc.

Come on, the coach is an OU grad. The “best interest” is thrown out the window when you know he is personally connected (and I would say that about all coaches pushing a player to their Alma mater). Obviously, he Could still have the kids best interest at heart, but since he pushed him to his own school the coaches motivation has to be questioned. At least a little bit.

everyone is going to have bias in some way, shape, or form. I happen to know a kid who just signed with ND last December and I know that a few ND alums were in his corner giving him advice. Should we question that as well?

Sure, it is entirely possible that the guy was acting in his own self interest. It's also entirely possible that the guy legitimately thinks (for whatever reason) that the kid is better off at OU.

I don't think that we need to fire the guy, as Sons of Galway insists.

I am looking at it from the perspective of the parent, not from the perspective of Notre Dame.

If my son had made the decision to go to a school, I am assuming it would have been a decision that was discussed at great length with the family. If, after the family and the son had made the decision, a football coach tried to change my son’s mind, I would be very unhappy with that coach.

I understand your point, that sometimes a football coach is more than just a football coach. I would not have any problem with the coach giving advice along the way, but once the decision was made, I would be unhappy, as a parent, if the coach tried to change my son’s mind.

Right?

and before you continue, it's only fair to point out to you that I am very familiar with how this process goes, who is involved, when a coach should be consulted, etc. One might say that I am close to this sort of situation, from a coach and a parent perspective. As a father, I would definitely consult with the head football coach, possibly a trainer (as many kids work with trainers outside of their team), a position coach, and anyone that can give me guidance and help me see things that I might otherwise miss. And I am saying that as a dad who happens to have about 40 years of experience of being around the game; if I was less familiar, I might seek out even more advice. Why would I cut off someone that I know and trust who might have an opinion that would be worthwhile considering? It would be stupid to not be completely thorough, and the honest truth is that Notre Dame is going to come out on top most of the time in these situations. It didn't work out this time, but I personally know of at least 2 other cases and situations in which it did and I'm sure that it happens all the time.

Your initial post that this man ought to be fired is completely ridiculous and borne out of selfishness that he didn't encourage the kid to go to ND. For all you know the coach has examined the situation and has determined in his mind that OU is better for a variety of reasons. If he can sway the kid that easily, the kid never really completely bought in to begin with. And furthermore, maybe the coach knows that the kid isn't a great fit for ND (for whatever reason).

Saying that a guy should be fired for expressing and sharing his opinion with a kid that he works with and mentors is completely selfish and ridiculous.

And I might add that you are completely mischaracterizing my position.

First, you make the assumption that I am taking this position because it’s Notre Dame that is getting screwed. That is not the case at all, as I have tried to make clear several times to you now. You seem to assume that everybody here is just a Notre Dame homer. You also seem to assume that someone pointing out that something that an opposing coach or school or has done is not exactly above board must be borne out of such homerism.

That is not the case with me. My objection is not that Notre Dame is getting screwed. My objection is that this was not advice that was given during the process, but instead was an attempt to change a boy’s mind after he had already made it up, presumably after consultation with his family and presumably the coach.

I have been around enough football coaches to know that most of them are not smart enough to take seriously when it comes to matters like higher education. Many of them are semi- fascist troglodytes, and your assumption his high school coach is some kind of Saintly father figure is naïve and ridiculous.

Just so you know, this is about my objection as a parent to an outsider trying to change a child’s mind after it has already been made up. I have no objection to taking advice or listening to football coaches about what they know about other football coaches, but most coaches wouldn’t know a high-quality higher education from a low quality higher education. Thus, the value of their advice is limited to the football field.

By the way, one of the reasons I hate Brian Kelly so much is that I think he leans more toward the fascist, nut ball type of coach that I have always despised. I don’t think he gets Notre Dame, and I’m not sure I would even want my son to play for him.

But that has nothing to do with my objection here, which is that a high school football coach should stay out of it after a decision has been made.

You may have had a different experience, as I know you played for St. John’s, if I’m correct. Your coach actually was one of the few father figures that I would trust in the coaching fraternity to influence my son. My experience is different. My high school coach was dumber than a bag of hammers and an asshole to boot, but he won a bunch of state championships so all of his indiscretions were overlooked. But I sure as hell wouldn’t let him influence my son’s college decision, and if he tried I would have moved my son to a different school.

Ok man.

All of my personal experience with this is out the window. The damn guy talked to the kid after he committed to Notre Dame! Fire him now! I mean, 17 year old kids NEVER make rash decisions that they perhaps might not have thought all the way through.

You're right, Son of Galway. The guy should not only be fired, but he should be thrown in jail! And this isn't because Notre Dame got "screwed" (NOOOOOOOO, of course not), this is because you and I have the young man's best interests at heart! He should be given life in prison without parole, as it is completely obvious that he did this only to further his own personal agenda!

I mean, we know that the coach certainly NEVER said anything prior to the commitment and only brought this stuff up AFTER the kid committed to ND. Truly nefarious!

And yes, my position on this was certainly naive, thanks for pointing that out. I don't have any idea what this process entails, thanks so much for pointing it out to me! Why, until you explained things so rationally, I thought that every high school football coach in the country was like Father Fuckin Flanigan! Now I know! You have opened my eyes, Son of Galway. I am eternally in your debt.

All sarcasm aside, let's revisit this post after the two national signing days occur. I might possibly move it up to after the first signing day, depending on how things work out.

On one hand, "pushing hard for" and "interfering" with a kid's decision is overstepping one's duties as a high school coach and going beyond providing guidance. At least that's my gut reaction to reading those terms.

Perhaps these are editorial flourishes of the situation, as I don't see any comments from Abiara that his coach is driving this. Possibly this stuff is coming from ND recruiting sites (given their incentives).

And to your point, I agree with the premise that a kid should seek credible counsel and perspectives wherever available, and stir them into the mix of how he is making his decision. I'd think a coach with major college playing experience and having other players he coaches go through the process would be an obvious piece of the puzzle.

"Interfering" and "Pushing Hard" is on the opposite end of the spectrum of "Credible Counsel" and "Providing Guidance."

That's the quote I was going off on. Nobody has any context, as you point out, but we've got an ND fan on an ND board who doesn't need context and just demands that the coach lose his job. We've got another fan saying that we need to see if said coach takes a job at OU in the next few years. But these aren't Homer's (perish the thought) they are just approaching it as if they were the kids dad. Meanwhile, someone who has experience on all 3 sides of this (as a player, coach, and father) in this situation needs to step back because his experience isn't relevant.

In other words, no, we're not both right. Sons of Galway is 100% wrong at this point given the information we know.

How can that be when you didn’t make one of your usual hilarious quips about USAA insurance? I do see, however, that you managed to slip in a standard “bagman“ comment and your old standby “grades” snark into this thread.