In reply to: I already did posted by Winter Celtic
1) What elaborate lie? People asked questions on here and no fully knowing how it looks, I answered and explained.
2) If anyone on NDN who donated wants their money refunded I will do so, absolutely. I will contact them myself now as it was about 3-4 people.
You didn't get a security guy to give you "access," as you first claimed, and you sure as heck didn't get thousands of dollars of game tickets, South Beach lodging, fanzone tickets, and all the rest for $200-$300 dollars total. That laughable "explanation" is precisely what I'm talking about. And you know it. So does everyone else reading this thread. You're bad at this.
Second, since you were mooching off of people while spending thousands of dollars on your own recreation, and pretending to be broke, don't ask them if they want their money back. Tell them the truth and apologize, and send them the money back whether they ask for it or not. Not just NDN people, either -- everyone you conned. And when you do it, ask each of them to come here and tell everybody that you paid them back. You've pissed all over trust, so now it's down to verify.
it at work this afternoon!
... who is jumping to a few conclusions in order to pass some of these judgments.
Again, I acknowledge how this looks to some of you. But I didn't "con" people out of thousands of dollars and then turn around and spend it on a trip. That simply did not happen. But you've obviously made up your mind to the contrary and nothing I say or provide will change it. So we're done.
Like I say, you suck at this.
You could have changed the way this all "looks to some people" by providing a plausible explanation for why you visibly spent thousands of dollars on the game while begging for money from others. You didn't provide that explanation, because you don't have it. You don't have it because it doesn't exist.
And I just told you what you could "provide" now. You could "provide" all the dog money back to the people who gave it to you, and "provide" proof from them that you've done so. But you're not going to do that either, because that would require you to admit the truth and give back the money.
You're going to explain those discrepancies, and you're going to explain them now.
He had to have made up his mind about the trip, or even paid for most of these expenses for the whole thing before soliciting funds for the dog. Now he's trying to make it seem like this was a snap judgement and he decided to go after the dog bit was done.
His Twitter shows pictures from the Sun Life Stadium Tour on 1/6. So much for staying at Mom's house.
We spent the day Saturday with my mother in Orlando. Then we drove to West Palm to have dinner with her friends, because I was intending to drive the kid down to the pep rally that night.
Because hey -- all you paid for all weekend was gas and a program!
Did he drive 3.5 hours each way every single one of those days? Or just take a vacation in FL for the weekend?
We drove down to Orlando Friday, spent the day with Mom Saturday and made the trip down to Miami (2.5 hrs each way) Sunday and Monday (yes, I drove straight back after the game... though admittedly left after the 3rd).
Carl Cunningham @carlcunningham
Screw it, I'm staying til the bitter end. #irishpride
I think we missed 2 scores (one by each team). But at that point it was better to beat the crowd and get on the road.
No way I'd have left if the game was in doubt, though.
Posted at 8:09 PM though, so perhaps that was a thought after Bama's first touchdown?
He's hinting around about VIP tickets for the spring game.
that is closer to Miami.. And the 5th was Saturday
Upon being offered the tickets:
"There are truly some amazing people in this world, despite the negativity that gets most of the attention. Wow."
"And thanks to the generosity of a couple of amazing people my son Donovan and I are going to the #DiscoverBCS National Championship game!! "
You still had to have incurred more expenses than the $2-300 you claim with all that supposed driving back and forth from Orlando to Orlando. Gas alone! Not to mention parking on South Beach (at the Pep Rally, not free) road tolls, your son's souvenir, food/drink. I'm sure there was more than that. Need I go on?
You begged others for money while spending at least several hundred on your own recreation and entertainment. It doesn't matter if you funded a lavish trip or only spent a few hundred. Asking for donations was a shady move, though I'm not surprised it's lost on you.
I'm not checking your tweets and I don't have Facebook, but there's a hoard of internet tough-guy Magnum PIs.
If that second tweet is real, it goes a long way in your favor.
Or he's a sociopath who knew people might look into his story.
If I was going to con people out of money in order to attend the game I would have done the same thing.
But now the internet Sherlock Holmes's are pulling things out their asses, instead of Winter Celtic.
The information they would need to verify his story. There are people here friends with him on facebook. A phone call to the security company and a quick ten second conversation with the guy who gave him the tickets would clear a lot of this up.
Of course I'd still be pissed if I gave him money for the dog. That $200-300 he spent on the trip could've easily gone to the dog's fund, and there's no excuse for not being upfront with people in the first place.
Once again, Mea Culpa on bringing the Rocky thing to NDN at all. I posted it here once and that was that, but I now fully acknowledge that was once too many.
I didn't bring up the Florida trip because I viewed it as a separate issue. I already put aside over 2k of my own cash for Rocky, and that went untouched... as did every other penny donated (all of which is being held by Paypal anyway).
But, yes, I understand the moral conflict many see here. And I'm sorry.
You say you didn't spend any of the money donated to your dog's surgery because you put all of the expenses of the trip on plastic. Obviously money is scarce for you - so what money are you going to use to pay the credit card bills?
And easily findable from his Dog Sob story fundraiser page.
the tickets around his neck in the one picture appear to be regular tickets and not event staff passes like he claims?
Because wasn't the original story that he got into the game via the security team?
I'm not even sure if they had "event passes" for this game. But, yes, he had 2 regular tickets. Nothing special. They looked just like all the others.
and people working the game received these credentials to get in. I know people who were there the whole week preparing for and working the game and even they had to scrape and beg just to get these passes.
you move the football on what to be outraged about. And, by you, I mean everyone.
@carlcunningham: @orangebowl I'm attending BCS National Championship Game Sun Life Stadium Tour #OrangeBowl #DiscoverBCS #BCShchamps @FightingIrish
@carlcunningham: @FightingIrish I'll be going to the #orangebowl for the #DiscoverBCS Bring back the crystal football! #GoIrish http://t.co/15ORdRwL
12/23/12, 1:26 AM
went down regardless of having tickets or not. And I was one of them.
Were you down in Miami from Orlando for the first, second or third time at the point of this tweet?
"And thanks to the generosity of a couple of amazing people my son Donovan and I are going to the #DiscoverBCS National Championship game!!"
2:12 PM - 5 Jan 13
I specifically remember, because I had just gotten the phone call while in Orlando.
You knew you were going to the game before being there the day of the game, which conflicts with your previous claim that you and your son had simply planned to be there for game day to just enjoy the atmosphere (like a lot of other fans).
"Hey son! Wanna hang out in a parking lot for your birthday?!"
And I would have happily been among them.
That removed where you said the plan was for you and your son to go down sans tickets.
Now it's "you would happily would have". Had you not scored them ahead of time.
I'd quit now. You are digging yourself deeper and deeper...better to admit you fucked up, be contrite, and move on. You aren't doing yourself any favors right now. My 2 cents..FWIW.
And their twitter and Facebook accounts said as much. Yet somehow you never mentioned a single time that you were heading down hoping to score tickets. For free no less.
That he knew he had them already by 12/16 when he posted this:
@carlcunningham: @B_Jax2 @sapphire2momma Awesome! My son's bday is also on 1/7. He'll be 10 and we'll be at the game in Miami to celebrate! GO IRISH!
I'm sure that by "at the game" he meant "in Miami unless some generous soul gives us free tickets!"
We all know 10 year olds enjoy parking lot hangouts for their birthday gifts just as much as the games themselves!
I told my friends my brothers were "at the game" on Monday and they did not originally have tickets to the game. They ended up scalping two tickets and attending that day, but I would definitely differentiate between someone saying they were "at the game" and someone saying they "attended the game".
And while I think WC is guilty of something, I don't know if he's guilty of conning people out of their money so be could attend the game on Monday. I think his reluctance to divulge personal details about his weekend is interesting given his public Facebook and twitter accounts, both of which contain his full name.
I do love playing Internet detective though.
I think he's in a precarious financial situation but wanted to go to the game. Instead of making the hard choice between his dog's surgery and the travel expenses he solicited money on the Internet for the dog and is now here pretending he was the recipient of a ridiculous amount of charity instead of just admitting he spent what money he had on the game and got a bunch of other people to pay for the dog.
Are you trying to defend WinterCeltic?
I'm trying to point out that seventy-zillion posts parsing something he wrote on the internet, while getting attacked from dozens of people, are too many. These posts would be the ones about where he was (4 miles south of WPB), or how he manages his finances, or what the term "access" means.
If my responses cause a poster to think twice before attacking or maybe consider that WC is not a con man, then I guess I am defending him. But, it's against he posts 11-200 in this thread, not posts 1-10.
That's why I advised him to cut bait and stop defending himself. It was just getting uglier.
I don't think that's necessary.
It's not something I'm passionate about, though.
That's five days.
Why drive to Miami twice if you just used the access/tickets you obtained through the generosity of ELITE security to go to the game and did nothing else?
I paid nothing for tickets (not to the tour or fanzone or the game) and I didn't stay in a hotel. Not even a single night. The entirety of my "souvenir" purchases was a 20 dollar game program for the kid. What else do you want to know?
judgement and rectified the situation by returning the money without it being requested.
$200-$300 is ridiculous; that barely pays for the gas. Game tickets, food, parking, souvenirs, where you stayed Monday night.
I didn't buy tickets or stay in a hotel. I stayed in Orlando Fri, Sat, Sun, AND Monday. Gas was probably $200-300, you're right. Oh, and I did buy a game program for the kid, 20 bucks there.
Anyway, I'm done. The day has been ruined by this tedious witch hunt enough. I was wrong for bringing the dog story to NDN at all. And I apologize. And if anyone wants any more detail on any this they are welcome to email me. Otherwise, I'm done.
You were 'done' before this thread even made it the BR.
I can't remember. Getting old sucks.
Who posted semi naked pics of his wife?
but after all that and he hit the troublesome time he's mentioned hen he talked about finances being low, didn't he later post about the new gaming system/games he had purchased?
Something like that is stuck in my mind, but I'm not the best about keeping track of all this.
Unfortunately, the Star Wars handle "IrishJedi" was me, though. But I'm not the game system guy, no.
I do not want to name anyone else publicly.
Your original claim was that you got the tickets for free through the security company. When a few people pointed out that that's impossible, you suddenly invoked some kind of confidentiality concern.
Return the damn money, apologize back here, and make yourself scarce.
Because I did in fact get into the stadium and get game tickets from someone I know with ELITE Security (through my dealings with them at San Diego Comic-Con in he past). That's it.
...those tickets are highly regulated by those who receive them.
Unless you donated a kidney to save this guy's life, the possibility he was able to get two tickets out of their alleged allotment and then give them to you for free strains credulity, as does your claim you drove over 500 miles round trip every day for four days.
I'm honestly unsure if there's an allotment given to the security firm. He had 2 tickets that he was going to give to some family who didn't make the trip.
As for the drive, it was more like 400 miles RT and we only went down there 2 days.
He has tickets worth about $1k each, and first he's going to give them to "some family", and then he's going to give them to you, a random person he's seen at Comi-Con.
You must be the luckiest person in the universe to know these people.
First, this guy wouldn't be selling the tickets. He was going to give them to somebody. And it's not a random encounter. I know the guy (yes, through Comic-Con but not simply through bumping into him or anything) and contacted him ahead of time just in case the opportunity arose. And yes we were very lucky that it did.
Seriously, though, he is a nice guy. And he's offered to accommodate me (if he can) whenever ELITE is running security at events.
Transfer it to checking and pay back each and every person in full that donated a penny. Have them come back on here and verify that you repaid the money.
Edit: removed my theory.
A pair of tickets to some of those events would probably cover all of the dog's medical bills in a charity auction.
Wouldn't you want your tickets going to someone who could sell them to save a poor dog's life?
His sister lives in Los Angeles so it doesn't cost him anything to stay there and drive back and forth to San Diego every day.
Now it's that you "got into the stadium" and "got tickets."
If some friend of yours gave you tickets why even invoke the security firm? Unless of course you also told someone else some sob story which would be even more phenomenally classless.
... you spontaneously started talking about how lucky you were to get "access" to the stadium tour? And not about how lucky you were to get thousands of dollars of game tickets for free?
Like I say, even with all the practice you've had, you're still bad at this.
And Bonger, you're on something of a fool's errand. You'll never catch a liar in his lies by asking him for more explanations, because he can always make up some more. Instead, you compare his story to what you know, both specifically about him and generally about how the world works. Specifically, for instance, this guy first said he got "access" from a buddy in game security. When advised that we can all see him wearing actual game tickets around his neck, the story is that the buddy gave him thousands of dollars of tickets for free. Now, when it's pointed out that didn't say he got free tickets, he said he got "access," he says that when he said "access" he meant the dinky little stadium tour and just forgot to mention the thousands of dollars worth of free tickets. And others note that his facebook page showed him doing other costly things -- which he now simply denies, claiming he drove back to his Mom's house in Orlando every night.
More generally, he visibly was begging for money at the same time he was going to the BCS championship game in Miami. So flag pops up there. Then he says a buddy he met at Comic-con and who was a manager of the game security force not only snuck him into the stadium tour (what?), but gave him the thousands of dollars worth of free tickets. As grown people we know that's just not plausible, and adding that to what we know specifically gets us further down the road.
And once you've confronted a liar, you're not going to get far by asking more questions and listening to what he actually says in any detail. Instead you ask more questions and watch him, and listen to how the story changes rather than the details of what's in it. Does the story simultaneously get more elaborate and less plausible? Check. Does he get defensive ("You're a very judgmental person")? Check. Does he throw up roadblocks to dangerous questions ("What, now you want my buddy's name and address and hat size?"). Check. That behavior, combined with what we know about his story, gets to the conclusion.
He was caught in a lie from the start. When confronted, he gave an explanation that didn't come close to explaining the truth and that was itself implausible. Everything he's said since then has been just what you would expect a cornered liar to say. There's a very simple way for him to square it -- give the money back and have the donors tell us he's done so -- but he's not interested. So. He's lying, and he's a con man. He's not going to change just because the thread gets longer.
Suddenly things are becoming a little more clear.
You were pictured with two tickets to the game.
How did you get those tickets?